{"code":"26395","sect":"Central America","sect_slug":"central-america","hits":"282","link":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/en\/202209\/centroamerica\/26395","link_edit":"","name":"\u201cIf the elections are clean, a progressive victory is possible in Guatemala\u201d","slug":"-ldquo-if-the-elections-are-clean-a-progressive-victory-is-possible-in-guatemala-rdquo-","info":"Jord\u00e1n Rodas, Guatemala\u2019s ex-human rights ombudsman who fled the country in August for fear of arrest, says he\u2019s optimistic that growing indignation on the part of citizens could usher in a progressive presidency. He says he hasn\u2019t ruled out \u2014that is, he would enjoy\u2014 being that candidate.","mtag":"Politics","noun":{"html":"\u003Cspan class='tint-text--dark' data_href='\/user\/profile\/jlsanz'\u003E Jos\u00e9 Luis Sanz\u003C\/span\u003E","data":{"jose-luis-sanz":{"sort":"jlsanz","slug":"jose-luis-sanz","path":"jose_luis_sanz","name":"Jos\u00e9 Luis Sanz","edge":"0","init":"0"}}},"view":"282","pict":{"cms-image-000037982-jpg":{"feat":"1","sort":"37982","name":"cms-image-000037982.jpg","link":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000037982.jpg","path":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000037982.jpg","back":"","slug":"cms-image-000037982-jpg","text":"<p>Jord\u00e1n Rodas, exprocurador de Derechos Humanos de Guatemala. Foto de El Faro: V\u00edctor Pe\u00f1a.<\/p>","capt":"\u003Cp\u003EJord\u00e1n Rodas, exprocurador de Derechos Humanos de Guatemala. Foto de El Faro: V\u00edctor Pe\u00f1a.\u003C\/p\u003E"},"cms-image-000038034-jpg":{"feat":"0","sort":"38034","name":"cms-image-000038034.jpg","link":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000038034.jpg","path":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000038034.jpg","back":"","slug":"cms-image-000038034-jpg","text":"<p>Former candidate for the People's Liberation Movement (MLP), Thelma Cabrera, greets supporters during a campaign rally at the Plaza de la Constituci\u00f3n in Guatemala City on June 8, 2019. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3\u00f1ez\/AFP<\/p>","capt":"\u003Cp\u003EFormer candidate for the People's Liberation Movement (MLP), Thelma Cabrera, greets supporters during a campaign rally at the Plaza de la Constituci\u00f3n in Guatemala City on June 8, 2019. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3\u00f1ez\/AFP\u003C\/p\u003E"},"cms-image-000038035-jpg":{"feat":"0","sort":"38035","name":"cms-image-000038035.jpg","link":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000038035.jpg","path":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000038035.jpg","back":"","slug":"cms-image-000038035-jpg","text":"<p>Guatemala\u2019s former de facto president (1982-1983) and retired general, Jos\u00e9 Efra\u00edn Rios Montt, speaks with his daughter Zury Rios during a court hearing in Guatemala City on January 23, 2013, when prosecutors requested that R\u00edos Montt and retired general Jos\u00e9 Rodr\u00edguez be tried for genocide. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3nez\/AFP<\/p>","capt":"\u003Cp\u003EGuatemala\u2019s former de facto president (1982-1983) and retired general, Jos\u00e9 Efra\u00edn Rios Montt, speaks with his daughter Zury Rios during a court hearing in Guatemala City on January 23, 2013, when prosecutors requested that R\u00edos Montt and retired general Jos\u00e9 Rodr\u00edguez be tried for genocide. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3nez\/AFP\u003C\/p\u003E"},"cms-image-000038036-jpg":{"feat":"0","sort":"38036","name":"cms-image-000038036.JPG","link":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000038036.JPG","path":"https:\/\/elfaro.net\/images\/cms-image-000038036.JPG","back":"","slug":"cms-image-000038036-jpg","text":"<p>In the early morning hours of July 24, 2021, Jord\u00e1n Rodas (wearing a blue vest) accompanied former prosecutor Juan Francisco Sandoval to the Salvadoran border on the same day Sandoval was dismissed from the Special Prosecutor\u2019s Office against Impunity (FECI). A year later, facing government harassment, Rodas would also leave the country via El Salvador, traveling to Washington, D.C., en route to Europe. Photo: V\u00edctor Pe\u00f1a\/El Faro<\/p>","capt":"\u003Cp\u003EIn the early morning hours of July 24, 2021, Jord\u00e1n Rodas (wearing a blue vest) accompanied former prosecutor Juan Francisco Sandoval to the Salvadoran border on the same day Sandoval was dismissed from the Special Prosecutor\u2019s Office against Impunity (FECI). A year later, facing government harassment, Rodas would also leave the country via El Salvador, traveling to Washington, D.C., en route to Europe. Photo: V\u00edctor Pe\u00f1a\/El Faro\u003C\/p\u003E"}},"pict_main__sort":37982,"date":{"live":"2022\/09\/22"},"data_post_dateLive_YY":"2022","data_post_dateLive_MM":"09","data_post_dateLive_DD":"22","text":"\u003Cp id=\"docs-internal-guid-b328243d-7fff-535b-dc69-469410672c4b\" dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cem\u003E\u003Ca href=\"\/es\/202209\/centroamerica\/26366\/Jord%C3%A1n-Rodas-%E2%80%9CTenemos-hasta-fin-de-a%C3%B1o-para-concretar-una-candidatura-%C3%BAnica-de-oposici%C3%B3n%E2%80%9D.htm\"\u003ELeer en espa\u00f1ol\u003C\/a\u003E\u003C\/em\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EIt has become a disturbing custom in Guatemala that a few hours after \u2014and sometimes even before\u2014 leaving office, attorneys general, judges, or, in this case, the human rights ombudsman, secretly flee the country. They leave because they are afraid of being arrested under false charges as soon as they lose the immunity that came with their positions. In the past year, those who never enjoyed such protections \u2014mid-level anti-corruption prosecutors, journalists, human rights defenders\u2014 have fled the country by the dozens, seeking protection in Mexico, the United States, Costa Rica, or even El Salvador.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EJord\u00e1n Rodas says he\u2019s not in exile. But he left Guatemala the day before the end of his term as the human rights ombudsman, passing quietly through Mexico and then into the U.S. by land on August 19. El Faro interviewed him in Washington, D.C., where he spent two weeks on a stopover before continuing to the European city where he plans to stay for now (he asked that the exact location not be disclosed). In other words: a lot of precautions for someone who says he\u2019s not in exile.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003ERodas claims, \u003Ca href=\"\/en\/202104\/centroamerica\/25423\/%E2%80%9CWhether-on-the-Court-or-Not-I-Swore-to-Protect-the-Constitution%E2%80%9D.htm\"\u003Eas have others before him\u003C\/a\u003E, that he will soon return to Guatemala. In recent weeks, opposition parties \u003Ca href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/AmilcarPop\/status\/1566543689186525186\"\u003Ehave announced\u003C\/a\u003E their \u003Ca href=\"https:\/\/twitter.com\/AmilcarPop\/status\/1566479489286242310?s=20&t=_hODLup-4zcWY7jjM-Exig\"\u003Efirst local alliances\u003C\/a\u003E ahead of the June 2023 elections, and Rodas says that if a coalition of the Left and anti-corruption movements consolidates, he wants to run for congress, or maybe even president. If the voting is clean, he says, it will be possible to dislodge corrupt elites from power in Guatemala. Given that his candidacy for rector of San Carlos University, Guatemala\u2019s politically influential public university, was \u003Ca href=\"https:\/\/www.prensalibre.com\/guatemala\/politica\/eco-de-fraude-en-la-eleccion-de-rector-de-la-usac-suena-en-15-de-22-unidades-academicas\/\"\u003Ethwarted in June with reports of fraud\u003C\/a\u003E, his first challenge may be securing permission from election authorities to even register as a candidate.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EYou\u2019re not ombudsman anymore. And you never became rector of San Carlos University\u2026\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EI might still be able to become rector. But it would be really difficult, almost impossible. The \u201cPacto de Corruptos\u201d [the common refrain, \u201cpact of the corrupt\u201d] imposed my opponent, Walter Mazariegos, through a crude and fraudulent process, and in spite of the resistance of the Sancarlistas.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EDo you really think it\u2019s still possible to become rector? It seems like it would be hard for you to even return to Guatemala anytime soon.\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EI\u2019ll return. When I return will depend on how democracy evolves in the country, on the security situation, on freedom of expression\u2026 But I\u2019m not losing hope. I see my departure as temporary. There is a lot to do in Guatemala, and I think I can be of some use.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EAre you talking about returning before or after the 2023 elections? Or specifically for the elections?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EI\u2019m hoping to come back before. Despite these dark times we\u2019re in, I think I can help build new electoral alternatives for the population.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EAre you saying you want to run as a candidate?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EI\u2019m considering proposals for different positions. I\u2019m deciding whether to participate and, if so, in what way. It\u2019s been suggested that I seek a position in congress, or run for president or vice president. But I\u2019d accept any candidacy that would allow me to support progressive forces having a real say in the decision-making process.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E \u003Cfigure class=\"pict pict_land pict_move_posc 0 cs_img cs_img--curr rule--ss_c\" data-shot=\"pict\" data-hint=\"pict\"\u003E \u003Cdiv class=\"pict__pobj text-overflow\"\u003E\u003Cimg src=https:\/\/elfaro.net\/get_img?ImageWidth=3000&ImageHeight=2000&ImageId=38036 class=\"pobj\" style=\"max-width: 100%\" rel=\"resizable\" alt=\"In the early morning hours of July 24, 2021, Jord\u00e1n Rodas (wearing a blue vest) accompanied former prosecutor Juan Francisco Sandoval to the Salvadoran border on the same day Sandoval was dismissed from the Special Prosecutor\u2019s Office against Impunity (FECI). A year later, facing government harassment, Rodas would also leave the country via El Salvador, traveling to Washington, D.C., en route to Europe. Photo: V\u00edctor Pe\u00f1a\/El Faro\" \/\u003E\u003C\/div\u003E \u003Cfigcaption class=\"pict__text cs_img_caption folk_content typo_buttons line--ss_s0c line--ss_s0c--auto block full-width text-overflow rule--ss_l relative\"\u003E \u003Cdiv class=\"__content block-inline full-width align-top tint-text--idle relative\"\u003E In the early morning hours of July 24, 2021, Jord\u00e1n Rodas (wearing a blue vest) accompanied former prosecutor Juan Francisco Sandoval to the Salvadoran border on the same day Sandoval was dismissed from the Special Prosecutor\u2019s Office against Impunity (FECI). A year later, facing government harassment, Rodas would also leave the country via El Salvador, traveling to Washington, D.C., en route to Europe. Photo: V\u00edctor Pe\u00f1a\/El Faro \u003Cdiv class=\"photographer text_italic rule--ss_l tint-text--idle\"\u003E \u003C\/div\u003E \u003C\/div\u003E \u003C\/figcaption\u003E \u003C\/figure\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EDo you think you have a chance of winning an election?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EThe circumstances are hard. It would take a lot of political maturity; egos would have to be set aside, forces would have to join to present an alternative that represents something genuinely different. The population is fed up with corruption, something my candidacy for rector of San Carlos made clear. With a message as simple as \u201cmafias out of USAC\u201d I managed to reach the hearts and minds of the Sancarlistas, who represent a microcosm, I think, of what happens at the national level. If the people don\u2019t go out in the streets to protest, that\u2019s another issue, but the electoral system, as it stands, has been exhausted.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EAre you confident the opposition can unite behind a single presidential candidate?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EThat would be the sensible thing to do, if we don\u2019t want to continue being ruled by more of the same.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EWho should be part of this coalition? And who has already reached out to you?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EDifferent democratic forces have approached me, but I don\u2019t see it as a personal issue. There\u2019s a wide range of progressive parties and movements, and they have to be realistic; they have to recognize that they failed before because they were divided, and now they need to join forces. Today they have their small allowance of power \u2014 the six or seven seats in congress that allow them to survive politically. But repeating the same strategy would be selfish, really short-sighted, and would harm Guatemalan society. We need to unite progressive forces and formulate an alternative, so that hope can be born.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EYou say a \u201cwide range\u201d of progressive forces, but it doesn\u2019t seem like the left is very strong or popular in Guatemala at the moment. In congress, critical voices represent a very small bloc.\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EYes, but in the last general elections, if you add up the results, you\u2019ll see that progressive forces won 20% of the vote, enough for a person to make it to the second round.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EIt sounds like you want to be the next Thelma Cabrera in the upcoming elections, or join her on a ticket.\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EI won\u2019t rule anything out. All my respect and admiration to Thelma Cabrera, who took fourth place in 2019 and is an Indigenous woman who has achieved an important position of leadership in a macho and racist society. She represents a sector of society that has been excluded from decision-making, and to ignore her is to ignore the reality of the country. But it\u2019s not enough. We need to make a stop on our way, and pick up more leaders. There\u2019s still time.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E \u003Cfigure class=\"pict pict_land pict_move_posc 0 cs_img cs_img--curr rule--ss_c\" data-shot=\"pict\" data-hint=\"pict\"\u003E \u003Cdiv class=\"pict__pobj text-overflow\"\u003E\u003Cimg src=https:\/\/elfaro.net\/get_img?ImageWidth=3000&ImageHeight=2000&ImageId=38034 class=\"pobj\" style=\"max-width: 100%\" rel=\"resizable\" alt=\"Former candidate for the People's Liberation Movement (MLP), Thelma Cabrera, greets supporters during a campaign rally at the Plaza de la Constituci\u00f3n in Guatemala City on June 8, 2019. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3\u00f1ez\/AFP\" \/\u003E\u003C\/div\u003E \u003Cfigcaption class=\"pict__text cs_img_caption folk_content typo_buttons line--ss_s0c line--ss_s0c--auto block full-width text-overflow rule--ss_l relative\"\u003E \u003Cdiv class=\"__content block-inline full-width align-top tint-text--idle relative\"\u003E Former candidate for the People's Liberation Movement (MLP), Thelma Cabrera, greets supporters during a campaign rally at the Plaza de la Constituci\u00f3n in Guatemala City on June 8, 2019. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3\u00f1ez\/AFP \u003Cdiv class=\"photographer text_italic rule--ss_l tint-text--idle\"\u003E \u003C\/div\u003E \u003C\/div\u003E \u003C\/figcaption\u003E \u003C\/figure\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EWhat you\u2019re saying is that a political alternative is meaningless if it doesn\u2019t include the MLP [People's Liberation Movement] and CODECA [Campesino Development Committee]?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EIt would make more sense with them, with the MLP and WINAQ, with Semilla and the URNG, and with people from the faction of UNE who know that they need to keep their distance from the current government.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EDo you imagine former first lady and UNE presidential candidate Sandra Torres being part of that alliance?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EIt\u2019s hard to imagine, but not impossible. She is a woman with a lot of conviction and determination to be a candidate, who has had an important political career. This is why I\u2019m calling for a process of collective discussion. But with her or without her, we need to create an alternative. And with or without Jord\u00e1n Rodas, because I\u2019m not obsessed with being a candidate either.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EThese days, I\u2019ve been rethinking things. I\u2019ve been the director of a chess league, the director of a lawyers\u2019 guild, I had the opportunity to serve the country as human rights ombudsman, I was a municipal legal representative, I was on the city council in Xela, my native city, and I was a mayoral candidate\u2026 I\u2019m not ashamed to be a politician. But politics is a long game. It\u2019s not a 100 meter dash, it\u2019s a marathon. Chess players understand that you don\u2019t win in just four or five moves, and you don\u2019t only have to think about what your next moves are; you have to think about your opponent\u2019s, too.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EOf all the possible candidacies in the works for 2023, which do you think is the most dangerous for the country?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EWe run the risk that we change the face or gender of the president, but fall another floor underground into the basement that Guatemala has already become. After Jimmy Morales, we thought that was the worst it could get, but then came Giammattei. And if Manuel Conde were to win, that would be even worse. Conde would be even more authoritarian than Giammattei. It would be a death sentence for our democracy.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003ELogically, the government is trying to get all the country\u2019s mayors in line, through infrastructure investment projects, and that\u2019s why we see Conde at the president\u2019s side. It\u2019s an attempt to build up his image, but it\u2019s a contradictory one considering that Giammattei is the least popular president in the Americas, behind Pedro Castillo in Peru.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EAnd then there\u2019s Zury\u2019s candidacy...\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EWhat would a potential Zury R\u00edos victory in 2023 mean?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EFirst, we cannot ignore the resolution by the Inter-American Court [of Human Rights] that gives her permission to run, whether we like it or not. It will be the people who will get to decide, at the ballot box, whether they agree with her being president despite the fact that her father has been accused of genocide. She\u2019s exercising a legitimate right.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EOn the other hand, she also symbolizes the genocide, to an extent, and her victory would mean that Guatemalan society has not fully acknowledged the full dimensions of what happened, the horrors that were committed during the war. This \u2014without exculpating her for the positions she has taken\u2014 is the fault of the state, for not informing and educating its citizens about the horrors of the war. Most of the population is young, and they don\u2019t know what happened during those 36 years of violence. The disappearance of one of my brothers is listed in the \u003Ca href=\"\/en\/202205\/centroamerica\/26172\/Guatemalan-Judge-under-Threat-after-Ordering-Trial-in-1980s-%E2%80%9CDeath-Squad-Dossier%E2%80%9D-Case.htm\"\u003EDiario Militar case\u003C\/a\u003E. As a victim and as an informed citizen, I would never vote for her.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E \u003Cfigure class=\"pict pict_land pict_move_posc 0 cs_img cs_img--curr rule--ss_c\" data-shot=\"pict\" data-hint=\"pict\"\u003E \u003Cdiv class=\"pict__pobj text-overflow\"\u003E\u003Cimg src=https:\/\/elfaro.net\/get_img?ImageWidth=3000&ImageHeight=2000&ImageId=38035 class=\"pobj\" style=\"max-width: 100%\" rel=\"resizable\" alt=\"Guatemala\u2019s former de facto president (1982-1983) and retired general, Jos\u00e9 Efra\u00edn Rios Montt, speaks with his daughter Zury Rios during a court hearing in Guatemala City on January 23, 2013, when prosecutors requested that R\u00edos Montt and retired general Jos\u00e9 Rodr\u00edguez be tried for genocide. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3nez\/AFP\" \/\u003E\u003C\/div\u003E \u003Cfigcaption class=\"pict__text cs_img_caption folk_content typo_buttons line--ss_s0c line--ss_s0c--auto block full-width text-overflow rule--ss_l relative\"\u003E \u003Cdiv class=\"__content block-inline full-width align-top tint-text--idle relative\"\u003E Guatemala\u2019s former de facto president (1982-1983) and retired general, Jos\u00e9 Efra\u00edn Rios Montt, speaks with his daughter Zury Rios during a court hearing in Guatemala City on January 23, 2013, when prosecutors requested that R\u00edos Montt and retired general Jos\u00e9 Rodr\u00edguez be tried for genocide. Photo: Johan Ord\u00f3nez\/AFP \u003Cdiv class=\"photographer text_italic rule--ss_l tint-text--idle\"\u003E \u003C\/div\u003E \u003C\/div\u003E \u003C\/figcaption\u003E \u003C\/figure\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EWhat will decide the outcome of the 2023 election?\u00a0\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EThe international community has to be very attentive to ensure that there are fair and free elections, and that the Supreme Electoral Tribunal (TSE) is not manipulated to define who can participate So far, the TSE has been a respected institution, but I hope it doesn\u2019t give into forces that would use it to discriminatorily block or allow certain candidacies to be criminalized.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EThat already happened in 2019 with Thelma Aldana and R\u00edos herself.\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003ENow the fears are even more well-founded, because we can see that certain actors are campaigning in advance of the electoral season, and that the TSE and other institutions have not equitably issued reprimands. If the election is manipulated, the international community will hopefully refuse to recognize the results.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EWhat is your opinion on the role of the international community in the current situation in Guatemala?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EIn recent years, we\u2019ve had governments quite hostile to the international community. The past two administrations made a perverse bet on isolation, with a double-standard on questions of sovereignty in which, on the one hand, we welcomed the donation of vaccines, and on the other, we refused to hear any criticism from the State Department, the Inter-American Commission, or the European Parliament on issues of human rights and judicial independence. The Office of the U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights, for example, is under intimidation by the Guatemalan government because its presence in the country is up for debate every year, and is conditioned on how it acts. Many international officials in Guatemala have simply accepted that they\u2019re virtually invisible.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EIn the end, it\u2019s up to Guatemalans to defend our democracy. We have the example of the \u003Ca href=\"\/en\/202201\/centroamerica\/25922\/%E2%80%9CBecoming-president-of-Guatemala-requires-resources-that-I-don%E2%80%99t-have%E2%80%9D.htm\"\u003E48 Cantons of Totonicap\u00e1n\u003C\/a\u003E, which recently went so far as to stop Congress from instituting repressive measures intended to prevent citizens from demonstrating.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003ECabrera, the 48 Cantons\u2026 You give the impression that campesino and Indigenous movements are the major source of legitimacy in the country at the moment. That the most important political forces in Guatemala are outside the capital.\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EOur hope is in the departments in the interior, in women, in the flame that was lit at San Carlos....\u00a0 There are people who have already said, \u201ceverything has its limit.\u201d\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EYou haven\u2019t said a word about the private sector.\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EFormer commissioner Iv\u00e1n Vel\u00e1squez, now Colombia's Minister of Defense, said years ago that the most fundamental problem in Guatemala was the financing of political parties and campaigns. This is why I\u2019m in favor of public financing, because there\u2019s no such thing as a free lunch. We can\u2019t expect much from a private sector as conservative as ours\u2014from a CACIF [the Coordinating Committee of Agricultural, Commercial, Industrial, and Financial Associations] that is stuck in the stone age and goes so far as to claim that the current U.S. government is \u201cleftist.\u201d Really, they should be the ones most concerned about the deterioration of justice in the country, because they might have economic power right now, but organized crime is working to displace them and take it away.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EIt\u2019s encouraging, at least, that there are already international sanctions against some businessmen, so that the private sector, which backed Otto P\u00e9rez, Jimmy Morales, and now Alejandro Giammattei, sees that there is a cost, that their vision of pulling everything inward toward them, of hoarding power and wealth while the massive gap in inequality destroys the country, does not come without a cost \u2014 even though it\u2019s evident that the sanctions haven\u2019t had the desired effect so far. It\u2019s important for the United States to consider whether its policy is the right one, or whether it might need to tighten the screws a little more. In the end, it\u2019s the economic system that sustains our structural problems of inequality, corruption, discrimination against women and racism against Indigenous people. If this is not addressed within Guatemala and with the support of the international community, we\u2019ll continue to count the lost years.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EDo you really believe that at this moment, when dissidents are being persecuted and the justice system has been hijacked by forces aligned with the right, that a left victory is possible in Guatemala?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EThe material conditions are there. The population is becoming more and more fed up. The key is in the hands of four institutions \u2014the TSE, the Comptroller's Office, the Public Ministry, and the Constitutional Court\u2014 which should guarantee a transparent process, but might also hinder it. This is why international observation is necessary, and it\u2019s crucial that not only the United States but also the European Union, Canada, and other consolidated democracies guarantee from this moment on that next year\u2019s elections are fair and free. I believe that if the electoral process is clean, a progressive electoral victory is possible in Guatemala.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EYou say your hope is that Guatemala\u2019s progressive forces will put aside their individual interests, that the private sector will do an about-face and commit to justice, and that the international community will be firmer in its sanctions and guarantee a transparent process. Isn't that asking for a few too many miracles?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EProbably, ha, ha.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EAnd the public has yet to support your vision for change.\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EThe pendulum has been stuck on the right for a long time. That\u2019s why it\u2019s so important to work for change, not just by making speeches, but by changing public policies and budgeting priorities, so that the majority of the country benefits. We need to leave our corrupt and authoritarian governments behind, and not just in Guatemala, but across the region. We see it in El Salvador with Bukele, who violates human rights with mass arrests and persecutes the press. It\u2019s a regional evil. Nicaragua set the tone with Ortega, and the rest of the countries followed suit. To continue betting on conservative governments in the region would be to shoot ourselves in the foot, and this goes for the international community and the United States, too.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EMaybe hoping for the stars to align is asking too much, but something has to change in Guatemala. We\u2019re sinking deeper into the sewer. When they \u003Ca href=\"\/en\/202208\/centroamerica\/26331\/The-Case-against-Journalist-Jos%C3%A9-Rub%C3%A9n-Zamora-Was-Built-in-72-Hours.htm\"\u003Ecaptured Jos\u00e9 Rub\u00e9n Zamora\u003C\/a\u003E, I knew we were Nicaragua 2.0. Multiple justice workers and journalists have left the country, they\u2019ve raided the offices of elPeri\u00f3dico.... We could fall into despair and depression, but I think there\u2019s another way out. It\u2019s unlikely we\u2019ll ever be dealt all the cards we need to get us out of the dictatorship, but we need to bet everything we have. The alternative is to give in to conformism, to give it all up for lost. And if we don\u2019t succeed this time, I\u2019ll continue to insist that we try again.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EIn 2019, Thelma Aldana tried to run for president but ended up in exile. You tried to run for rector at San Carlos but there were allegations of fraud. You have even temporarily left the country. Now that you\u2019re saying what has been rumored for months in Guatemala, that you have political aspirations and would consider running as a candidate, don't you fear reprisals? Will you be surprised if the government suddenly opens a criminal investigation against you?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EIn Guatemala, being an anti-establishment candidate is always a risk. But that\u2019s not a reason to shun that path. Running for election is a right, and I\u2019m not going anywhere anytime soon. The question is whether the conditions will be right in 2023, and whether we can achieve results that will change the course of the country.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cstrong\u003EWhat should the timeframe be for such an alliance to materialize?\u003C\/strong\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp dir=\"ltr\"\u003EBy the end of the year, at the latest. It\u2019s an effort that deserves to be taken seriously, but also requires urgency.\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp\u003E\u00a0\u003C\/p\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cbr\/\u003E\u003Cp style=\"text-align: right;\" dir=\"ltr\"\u003E\u003Cem\u003E*Translated by Max Granger\u003C\/em\u003E\u003C\/p\u003E"}